Carrots in clay?

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Carrots in clay?

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Hedonists

Joined: 13 Jan 2005
Posts: 95
Location: Romford, Essex.

Posted: Fri Apr 01, 05 7:49 pm Post subject: Carrots in clay?

Our local 'soil' is very heavy, dense clay. Even after double digging, it soon recompacts. The few veggies I've grown so far don't seem to mind it too much, but my understanding is that carrots just won't tolerate these kind of conditions.

I've heard of people using sections of plastic drain pipe buried upright in the soil and filled with a lighter soil in which to grow carrots... today I thought of a variation on the theme. I was wondering whether I might have success using the inner cardboard from rolls of kitchen towel??? The idea is to dig out the clay, stand the cardboard rolls upright, fill them with a light compost and back fill the hole with clay to support the rolls. I'd then sow two seeds into each roll to try and ensure germination in each. Hopefully the cardboard rolls will eventually break down, which in turn should help to break down the clay.

I won't have enough cardboard rolls to attempt it this year, but if I save all of ours, I should have at least two or three dozen by about this time next year.

I was wondering if anyone had opinions on this theory?

jema
Downsizer Moderator

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 28111
Location: escaped from Swindon

Posted: Fri Apr 01, 05 7:52 pm Post subject:
Inventive, not enough experience to have a clue on how good an idea it is though. Our soil was clay and stone. The only thing we could realistically do for our very small patch was buy some more soil.

judith

Joined: 16 Dec 2004
Posts: 22789
Location: Montgomeryshire

Posted: Fri Apr 01, 05 7:55 pm Post subject:

In my experience, the cardboard rolls break down quite quickly once they are in the soil. But it might just be long enough to get your carrots off to a good start - or just to create a "core" of compost for the carrot to grow in. Certainly worth experimenting with.

Have you tried growing carrots in pots? They do quite well like that. Alternatively you could also try growing the stump-rooted varieties in the ground. They might not win any prizes on the show bench, but some carrots are better than none!

Bernie66

Joined: 14 Jan 2005
Posts: 13967
Location: Eastoft

Posted: Fri Apr 01, 05 7:58 pm Post subject:

have done it myself on my allotment with old toilet roll cardboard with sand /topsoil mix with pretty good success rate-then carrot fly!!! I think marigolds are supposed to frighten carrot flies but they did not help me. Have been advise now that once a carrot top/foliage is broken the carrot flies can smell it and that was probably my downfall-taking baby carrots and letting the scent get around. Better luck this time!

Naomi

Joined: 26 Mar 2005
Posts: 1945

Posted: Fri Apr 01, 05 8:21 pm Post subject:

When preparing the seed bed for sowing carrots, try making the drills deep almost like mini trenches. Then fill these with finely sieved compost ,mixed with sand or vermiculite etc and sow the carrot seeds into this.
I have had good success with this method and I too am on heavy clay.
Also plant your onions in between the carrot rows as the onion smell deters carrot fly. Try to sow thinly to avoid thinning the carrots as it is when you disturb them that carrot flies are attracted.
I use cardboard loo roll tubes to sow sweetcorn in indoors , as sweetcorn doesnt like its roots disturbed when planting out.
Hope that helps.

judyofthewoods

Joined: 29 Jan 2005
Posts: 804
Location: Pembrokeshire

Posted: Fri Apr 01, 05 8:58 pm Post subject:

just copied and pasted this from a post in another thread. The idea comes from a book where the author sais he has done it successfully. Is there any need to line the hole with cardboard? Why not just fill it with the mix?

"Not tried this method, but looks plausable. For growing carrots in heavy clay you could try to dig individual holes, then ramming a crowbar into the base to extend the hole downward, and wriggle it arround to create a cone. Probably best to do it when the soil is fairly dry as the clay would get a more waterproof edge if its effectively puddled. Fill the hole with a finer mix of soil, compost and sand. That way you can get started with improving the soil a bit at a time where you most need it, where the plant grows. Brobably not ideal, but might allow you to grow at least some carrots, even if the yield is less than in ideal conditions. "

Hedonists

Joined: 13 Jan 2005
Posts: 95
Location: Romford, Essex.

Posted: Fri Apr 01, 05 9:04 pm Post subject:

Judith wrote:

Have you tried growing carrots in pots? They do quite well like that. Alternatively you could also try growing the stump-rooted varieties in the ground.

This year I'll be trying out the stumpy variety as the supplier reckons they'll grow even in clay. I do have one large empty pot, that I've been wondering what to do with. Its probably just large enough to get two rows of three carrots - not much, but anything that extends our small garden is a bonus. Thanks for mentioning this, don't know why it didn't occur to me.

wellington womble

Joined: 08 Nov 2004
Posts: 15051
Location: East Midlands

Posted: Fri Apr 01, 05 9:15 pm Post subject:

You could do the grow bags on top of each other thing - might be easier than digging holes, or people here sometimes just dig a trench to the depth you want your carrot length, and fill it with compost.

I don't grow maincrops carrots, and all my baby ones go in shallow polystyrene meat boxes - fish boxes from the market would do as well, and be easy to get hold of (reletively) one year I made wooden boxes out of old pallets for them, as baby ones don't need much depth.

tahir

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 45420
Location: Essex

Posted: Fri Apr 01, 05 9:30 pm Post subject:
I grow carrots reasonably succesfully in good old Essex clay, my patch is 7 years old though. Just keep putting organic matter on and the soil structure soon starts changeing.

gavin

Joined: 10 Feb 2005
Posts: 93
Location: Leeds, W Yorks

Posted: Fri Apr 01, 05 10:31 pm Post subject:

Hi folks - just a thought.

Both the tubes and the crowbar idea should work - but it depends on how many carrots you want to grow? It took me nearly two hours to sow a couple of dozen parsnip "stations", doing something similar - by golly, they'd better reward the back pain that went into extracting those holes and filling them again!

Unless you want to grow large "show" carrots, I'd go for the trench idea - or even just cut a deep V shape with the spade - and fill with sand/soil and/or compost.

But don't take my word for it - I'm only just starting on clay!

Good luck - Gavin

Hedonists

Joined: 13 Jan 2005
Posts: 95
Location: Romford, Essex.

Posted: Fri Apr 01, 05 11:00 pm Post subject:
Tahir, our gaff is bult on the grounds of Harold Wood Hospital (we live in the shed next to the ante-natal ward ) so the ground hasn't been worked in decades. I've been treating the soil (feeding, digging, rakeing, planting, etc) for just under a year and can already see a difference to the top soil, but I fear it'll be a long while before I see a change to anything beneath the top inch or so.

Naomi

Joined: 26 Mar 2005
Posts: 1945

Posted: Sat Apr 02, 05 9:10 am Post subject:

When you say you have been feeding the ground, I presume you are adding lots of well rotted organic matter.
I have had to add loads of home made compost and farmyard manure ,before I began to notice a real difference in the friability of the soil.
I also put a really thick mulch of compost on top of the soil in winter and by spring it has all been incorporated into the soil.
Lots of local councils now make compost to sell and this is a good way to get really big loads cheaply if you havent made your own.

wellington womble

Joined: 08 Nov 2004
Posts: 15051
Location: East Midlands

Posted: Sat Apr 02, 05 9:38 am Post subject:
I can vouch for that - our municpal compost comes from the local tip. The binmen won't collect garden waste, so every time we do stuff in the garden, and take things down to the tip, we come back with a bag of compost. 2.50 a bag - about the same as a growbag I would say (it doesn't have a literage on it)

Naomi

Joined: 26 Mar 2005
Posts: 1945

Posted: Sat Apr 02, 05 9:46 am Post subject:
When I lived in Surrey/Sussex you could get a pick up truck load for about £35 . Don't know if they still allow bulk collection though, as I now make all my own .

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