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The Naughty Corner ?
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Bodger



Joined: 23 May 2006
Posts: 13510

PostPosted: Wed Dec 22, 10 1:38 pm    Post subject: The Naughty Corner ?  Reply with quote    

Can the first post in each of the threads in the Naughty Corner be duplicated on the main forum, so that non members of the corner can have the opportunity to discuss the topics that at the moment, are being dealt with behind closed doors?
I feel that inorder to take a full part in forum life non members of the Naughty Corner are being pressurised into signing up to a code of conduct that they don't necessarily agree with and why? Just to avoid feeling excluded.
If this idea were to be implemented, then hopefully the full membership of the forum would be able to discuss ALL the topics posted on the forum. The discussion could then be carried out in a civilised and friendly manner on the main forum. This would still leave corner members free to discuss topics in the manner to which they have now become accustomed.
At the moment, none corner members are very much second rate citizens with an us and them feeling about the place. A proportion of people simply don't feel the need to use expletives.
I presume that expletives and name calling etc might be the order of the day in the 'corner', but because I've not joined, of course I'm not privy as to how things are conducted over there.

Before the corner advocates start to give me grief on what is an honestly held opinion, please think about what I'm actually saying. I hope that you'll concede that the points that I've tried to make do have some validity. Its you freedom to eff and blind against mine and others freedom to be included.
When I joined Downsizer, one of the reasons that I did so, was that unlike the place that I'd come from it was very much an inclusive forum.

Fire away.

Bebo



Joined: 21 May 2007
Posts: 12569
Location: East Sussex
PostPosted: Wed Dec 22, 10 1:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

Bodger, join it, have a look and then unjoin. At least you'll then see that it isn't all arguments (it's mostly jokes and people venting about stuff that is affecting them in the real world). I'm sure you will survive a quick peak at a few four letter words

With regard to inclusivity, it is inclusive (apart from kids). Anyone old enough is free to join up, no one is excluded.

Only problem I see with copying the first post over is that sometimes the first post will contain stuff that is inappropriate for the main forum. Blue jokes and people swearing about something that they are struggling with are often opening posts.

Chez



Joined: 13 Aug 2006
Posts: 35907
Location: The Hive of the Uberbee, Quantock Hills, Somerset
PostPosted: Wed Dec 22, 10 1:50 pm    Post subject: Re: The Naughty Corner ? Reply with quote    

Bodger wrote:
At the moment, none corner members are very much second rate citizens with an us and them feeling about the place.


Sorry, Bodger, but I don't agree. I'm not a member and I don't feel excluded or second rate in any way. I joined, had a look at what was going on and unjoined. If you're worried about being excluded, just subscribe to it!

paul1963



Joined: 15 Nov 2010
Posts: 2161
Location: No longer active on the forum
PostPosted: Wed Dec 22, 10 1:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

Bebo wrote:
Bodger, join it, have a look and then unjoin. At least you'll then see that it isn't all arguments (it's mostly jokes and people venting about stuff that is affecting them in the real world). I'm sure you will survive a quick peak at a few four letter words

With regard to inclusivity, it is inclusive (apart from kids). Anyone old enough is free to join up, no one is excluded.

Only problem I see with copying the first post over is that sometimes the first post will contain stuff that is inappropriate for the main forum. Blue jokes and people swearing about something that they are struggling with are often opening posts.


It's all quite lighthearted, but as Bebo rightly says there is bad language that should maybe stay in a "niche" and not be too public

Bodger



Joined: 23 May 2006
Posts: 13510

PostPosted: Wed Dec 22, 10 1:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

Chez I can understand what you are saying but why should people have to sign up to behaviour and language that they don't believe in to be fully participating members of what was once a one hundred percent open forum.

At one time, the small business section at the top of the forum page was also hidden. I managed to get that opened to all. I think that openess and being inclusive is the way forward.

cab



Joined: 01 Nov 2004
Posts: 32429

PostPosted: Wed Dec 22, 10 2:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

Bodger wrote:
Chez I can understand what you are saying but why should people have to sign up to behaviour and language that they don't believe in tiobe fully participating members of what was once a one hundred percent open forum.

At one time, the small business section at the top of the forum page was also hidden too. I managed to get that opened to all.


On the whole, I agree with you.

But as it is a 'naughty' corner I can't see a way of having posts cross posted between the two. And while it amuses me to imagine the Benny Hill moments that would inevitably stem from the mods struggling wih parallell conversations in two places at once where they'd have to double check where they were before modding, and while I think the concept of people mistakenly posting some venomous abuse to the main forum rather than naughty corner would be briefly amusing, I think its unworkable.

But the question of whether we're missing something by potentially interesting discussions being held by a self selecting clique... I dunno. I doubt it. It is usually the nature of such cliques that they have little you really need to hear.

Last edited by cab on Wed Dec 22, 10 2:03 pm; edited 1 time in total

Bodger



Joined: 23 May 2006
Posts: 13510

PostPosted: Wed Dec 22, 10 2:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

Paul 1963 said "It's all quite lighthearted, but as Bebo rightly says there is bad language that should maybe stay in a "niche" and not be too public "
Whether the topics are light hearted or heavy, they are still topics and discussions that non 'Naughty Club' members can'tsee or participate in.

Cab, you maybe right in what you say about cliques but then, we'll never know will we?

Last edited by Bodger on Wed Dec 22, 10 2:05 pm; edited 1 time in total

Chez



Joined: 13 Aug 2006
Posts: 35907
Location: The Hive of the Uberbee, Quantock Hills, Somerset
PostPosted: Wed Dec 22, 10 2:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

Well, if people don't want to participate in the behaviour and language of that part of the forum, there's not much point doing anything other than ignoring it, is there?

As I see it, you don't want to be a part of it, but you still want to know what's going on in there. What's the point of that? Let it go.

arvo



Joined: 04 Dec 2006
Posts: 3321
Location: Somerset
PostPosted: Wed Dec 22, 10 2:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

Bodger wrote:
Chez I can understand what you are saying but why should people have to sign up to behaviour and language that they don't believe in to be fully participating members of what was once a one hundred percent open forum.

At one time, the small business section at the top of the forum page was also hidden. I managed to get that opened to all. I think that openess and being inclusive is the way forward.


Hear what you're saying Bodger, but the swearing/not swearing argument is kind of binary. Either the whole forum is open and therefore no swearing or theres a sweary corner so that the people who want to swear can and not bother the folk who don't. Since the naughty corner isn't restricted to join, isn't it the logical way to satisfy both groups?

cab



Joined: 01 Nov 2004
Posts: 32429

PostPosted: Wed Dec 22, 10 2:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

Bodger wrote:
Paul 1963 said "It's all quite lighthearted, but as Bebo rightly says there is bad language that should maybe stay in a "niche" and not be too public "
Whether the topics are light hearted or heavy, they are still topics and discussions that non 'Naughty Club' members can'tsee or participate in.


Frankly, if they want to go off and shout rude words in the periodical stacks of the library, I couldn't give a damn. Its unlikely that you'll miss much of interest.

Bebo



Joined: 21 May 2007
Posts: 12569
Location: East Sussex
PostPosted: Wed Dec 22, 10 2:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

Bodger wrote:
why should people have to sign up to behaviour and language that they don't believe in to be fully participating members of what was once a one hundred percent open forum.


Because if you open it up those that don't want to sign up to bad language will be offended, including those under the age of 16. That was the whole point of it being created in the first place.

Alternatively, the rules could be changed so that we can all swear in the main bit of the forum and those that don't like it just have to put up with it. Not a sensible solution is it?

Gervase



Joined: 17 Nov 2004
Posts: 8655

PostPosted: Wed Dec 22, 10 2:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

But there are other areas that are, perforce, private. The staff room, publishing, directors', meat traders' etc sections aren't open to all. The naughty corner is - all you have to do is join!
If you see that as a problem, the problem is with you, not the naughty corner. It's there waiting for you with open arms and a lascivious leer...

Bodger



Joined: 23 May 2006
Posts: 13510

PostPosted: Wed Dec 22, 10 2:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

Hobsons choice? You either have a secret enclave as we have now, or an open house where swearing is taken for granted, as participants try harder and harder to shock. Either way, its people who don't feel the need to swear but who want to be fully participating members who suffer.

cab



Joined: 01 Nov 2004
Posts: 32429

PostPosted: Wed Dec 22, 10 2:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

Bebo wrote:

Because if you open it up those that don't want to sign up to bad language will be offended, including those under the age of 16. That was the whole point of it being created in the first place.

Alternatively, the rules could be changed so that we can all swear in the main bit of the forum and those that don't like it just have to put up with it. Not a sensible solution is it?


You don't find that, on reflection, just a little bit naff? Unrelated to Bodgers point, you're saying that we've got a place for bad language because some members can't restrain themselves in open fora? We have to have seclusion for some discussions because they can't help themselves?

I don't think that Bodgers idea is workable. But I do think that some of the posts disagreeing with him rather miss the point; if decent content is held behind a barrier that some people quite reasonably don't want to cross, it does weaken the whole. Bodger is right about that.

cab



Joined: 01 Nov 2004
Posts: 32429

PostPosted: Wed Dec 22, 10 2:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

Bodger wrote:
Hobsons choice? You either have a secret enclave as we have now, or an open house where swearing is taken for granted, as participants try harder and harder to shock. Either way, its people who don't feel the need to swear but who want to be fully participating members who suffer.


Yeah, but you're not suffering. Do you really think we're missing much? I doubt it.

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