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vinegar instead of fabric conditioner
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Nicky Colour it green



Joined: 25 Jun 2007
Posts: 8693
Location: Devon, uk
PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 18 12:31 pm    Post subject:  Reply with quote    

Nick wrote:
Much of the dirt on clothes is acidic (skin mantle) so having a basic pH in your laundry is a good thing.


er so ...I am assuming laundry powder s generally basic ph, .... and vinegar is acidic... does that make it not a good thing?

Nick



Joined: 02 Nov 2004
Posts: 33866
Location: Hereford
PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 18 12:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

Nicky Colour it green wrote:
Nick wrote:
Much of the dirt on clothes is acidic (skin mantle) so having a basic pH in your laundry is a good thing.


er so ...I am assuming laundry powder s generally basic ph, .... and vinegar is acidic... does that make it not a good thing?


Honestly, I don't know. The more I think about it, the more I'm unsure, and the literature isn't massively helpful.

Nicky Colour it green



Joined: 25 Jun 2007
Posts: 8693
Location: Devon, uk
PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 18 12:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

Nick wrote:
Nicky Colour it green wrote:
Nick wrote:
Much of the dirt on clothes is acidic (skin mantle) so having a basic pH in your laundry is a good thing.


er so ...I am assuming laundry powder s generally basic ph, .... and vinegar is acidic... does that make it not a good thing?


Honestly, I don't know. The more I think about it, the more I'm unsure, and the literature isn't massively helpful.


fair enough

dpack



Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 34465
Location: yes
PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 18 4:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

if it helps

most detergents are sulphonated aliphatic mineral oils and could be considered mildly acidic

soaps are usually complex fats/oils with extra hydroxyls stuck on and could be considered mildly alkaline

the oily/fatty bit of the laundry product loosely bonds with the "greasy" part of muck and the charged bit grabs the water taking said muck with it

the muck in a washing machine is a very complex mix of stuff .

Nick



Joined: 02 Nov 2004
Posts: 33866
Location: Hereford
PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 18 4:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

dpack wrote:
if it helps

most detergents are sulphonated aliphatic mineral oils and could be considered mildly acidic

soaps are usually complex fats/oils with extra hydroxyls stuck on and could be considered mildly alkaline

the oily/fatty bit of the laundry product loosely bonds with the "greasy" part of muck and the charged bit grabs the water taking said muck with it

the muck in a washing machine is a very complex mix of stuff .


It is, and it's relatively easy to make good ones for here. I was discussing a high throughput analysis system for washing detergent formulation design with the guys at Unilever. Making a decent one here is easy. Making one that works in the various water conditions in the developing world is much more fun.

The thought you can improve on them by throwing a random amount of acid in with a wash doesn't hold (or release) much water, tbh, but I know people love to use vinegar to solve almost all global and local problems.

dpack



Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 34465
Location: yes
PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 18 8:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

brackish water can be quite a challenge, iirc quite a few places have plenty of it but potable water is too expensive for laundry
in some places laundry water would go on the garden which has another set of criteria
designing a laundry detergent which is good at cleaning as well as being hand friendly and reasonably non polluting at an affordable price might be a bit easier if water quality was a constant but at a considered guess there is a lot of variation even from one water source to the next even if the launderers all use the same shop
etc etc

i begin to see why doing it at an affordable price could be rather tricky

giving a river detergent a strong but river friendly and localised crocodile repellent activity as a bonus would be rather nice. iirc many crocodile issues involve laundry and doing your smalls without being eaten could be rather good for repeat sales

Mistress Rose



Joined: 21 Jul 2011
Posts: 10140

PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 18 7:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote    

I used to use vinegar as a hair conditioner in the days before they were readily available, and it worked well. A bit if vinegar in the last but one rinse when I used to wash hair in the sink as no shower head, then a final rinse in clean water. As we had hard water, I think the shampoo may have been at least part detergent, but the vinegar worked well at getting rid of the shampoo remains.

frewen



Joined: 08 Sep 2005
Posts: 11405

PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 18 8:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote    

Nick wrote:
dpack wrote:
if it helps

most detergents are sulphonated aliphatic mineral oils and could be considered mildly acidic

soaps are usually complex fats/oils with extra hydroxyls stuck on and could be considered mildly alkaline

the oily/fatty bit of the laundry product loosely bonds with the "greasy" part of muck and the charged bit grabs the water taking said muck with it

the muck in a washing machine is a very complex mix of stuff .

I love all of this

It is, and it's relatively easy to make good ones for here. I was discussing a high throughput analysis system for washing detergent formulation design with the guys at Unilever. Making a decent one here is easy. Making one that works in the various water conditions in the developing world is much more fun.

The thought you can improve on them by throwing a random amount of acid in with a wash doesn't hold (or release) much water, tbh, but I know people love to use vinegar to solve almost all global and local problems.

Nicky Colour it green



Joined: 25 Jun 2007
Posts: 8693
Location: Devon, uk
PostPosted: Wed Apr 25, 18 9:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote    

Nick wrote:


The thought you can improve on them by throwing a random amount of acid in with a wash doesn't hold (or release) much water, tbh, but I know people love to use vinegar to solve almost all global and local problems.


it does seem to come up as the answer to everything.....

wellington womble



Joined: 08 Nov 2004
Posts: 14967
Location: East Midlands
PostPosted: Wed Apr 25, 18 10:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote    

Don’t be silly. Baking soda is the answer to everything.

Slim



Joined: 05 Mar 2006
Posts: 5318
Location: New England (In the US of A)
PostPosted: Wed Apr 25, 18 11:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote    

I'm always amazed at the number of uses that people advocate a combination of the two.

I understand how dumping them down a clogged drain and covering the top can build pressure that will possibly clear the clog, but I've seen the combo proposed for all sorts of surface cleaning applications... I guess people think fizz means effectiveness.

(Though I think the abrasion of the baking soda, or the acidity of the vinegar will do more if they're used separately....)

Nicky Colour it green



Joined: 25 Jun 2007
Posts: 8693
Location: Devon, uk
PostPosted: Wed Apr 25, 18 5:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

wellington womble wrote:
Don’t be silly. Baking soda is the answer to everything.


how silly of me. and I googled it.. and yes, people to advocate putting baking soda in your washing machine.. because.. just like vinegar, makes your whites white and softens the water.....

I give up
I only asked about the vinegar instead of fabric softener because many moons ago people here said they did.. they are now either absent or quiet.....

Slim



Joined: 05 Mar 2006
Posts: 5318
Location: New England (In the US of A)
PostPosted: Wed Apr 25, 18 5:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

Are you now the only one here who uses fabric softener of any sort, or are there lurkers afraid to admit to it?

buzzy



Joined: 04 Jan 2011
Posts: 3443
Location: In a small wood on the edge of the Huntingdonshire Wolds
PostPosted: Wed Apr 25, 18 7:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

So where is the thread that advocates putting fabric softener on your chips instead of vinegar, or have I got the wrong idea?

Henry

sean
Downsizer Moderator


Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 41916
Location: North Devon
PostPosted: Wed Apr 25, 18 8:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

buzzy wrote:
So where is the thread that advocates putting fabric softener on your chips instead of vinegar, or have I got the wrong idea?

Henry


It certainly stops other people from pinching your chips.

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