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fruits with seeds on the outside
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Jb



Joined: 08 Jun 2005
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Location: 91� N
PostPosted: Fri Jan 29, 16 7:57 pm    Post subject: fruits with seeds on the outside Reply with quote
    

Arising from a quiz in the lab recently. Are there any fruits other than strawberries which have their seeds on the outside of the fruit's body?

Treacodactyl
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Joined: 28 Oct 2004
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Location: Jumping on the bandwagon of opportunism
PostPosted: Fri Jan 29, 16 8:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
    

Technically strawberries don't have seeds on the outside of the fruit as the red berry bit isn't a fruit.

NorthernMonkeyGirl



Joined: 10 Apr 2011
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Location: Peeping over your shoulder
PostPosted: Fri Jan 29, 16 11:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
    

Treacodactyl wrote:
Technically strawberries don't have seeds on the outside of the fruit as the red berry bit isn't a fruit.




Is the very definition of a fruit something that contains seeds?

In the spirit of the original question, nothing springs to mind immediately

jamanda
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Joined: 22 Oct 2006
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 29, 16 11:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
    

The bit we call the strawberry is a receptacle, which is bit of modified stem. The fruits are actually the little "seeds" which are actually achenes - similar to a little tiny sunflower seed.

And to answer the original question, I cannot think of any others.

Slim



Joined: 05 Mar 2006
Posts: 6533
Location: New England (In the US of A)
PostPosted: Sat Jan 30, 16 12:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
    

pineapple doesn't have external seeds, but a lot of what we would think of as the fruit towards the middle is also not truly fruit, as with strawberries.

Treacodactyl
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 30, 16 7:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
    

I almost said pineapple, although the seeds seem to be just under the surface, but when I googled it I got side tracked with people grwoing them from seed...

dpack



Joined: 02 Jul 2005
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 30, 16 10:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
    

i cant think of any for the reasons above.

perhaps exploding cucumbers count when in mid air

Mistress Rose



Joined: 21 Jul 2011
Posts: 15539

PostPosted: Sat Jan 30, 16 10:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
    

To some extent raspberries, blackberries and all similar variations have the seeds on the outside but in pockets of flesh and juice.

dpack



Joined: 02 Jul 2005
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 30, 16 11:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
    

i dont think b and r berries are technically fruit

iirc the definition of fruit includes "contains seeds" which covers pea pods as well as pears ie if the seeds are on the outside it aint a fruit.

where a fruiting body comes is a whole new can of spores

Slim



Joined: 05 Mar 2006
Posts: 6533
Location: New England (In the US of A)
PostPosted: Sat Jan 30, 16 12:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
    

yew "berries" are always an interesting addition to discussions like these. First off, they're from a gymnosperm which by definition has no fruit. Secondly, they wouldn't be a "berry" botanically if the red part was a fruit.

The red bit is a fleshy aril that has evolved to sweeten, soften and turn color similarly to the fleshy receptacle on a strawberry (which is covered in true fruits which each contain a seed)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aril may describe this better than I do

dpack



Joined: 02 Jul 2005
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 30, 16 10:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
    

the flora and mycology seems to know what it is doing i recon it us us dumb humans who try to classify things in a clumsy way that dont

perhaps organ for holding developing reproductive genetic material and enabling it's distribution once developed would cover all of em fruit or not

but help yourself from the " organ for holding developing reproductive genetic material and enabling it's distribution once developed " bowl is a bit awkward to say

Mistress Rose



Joined: 21 Jul 2011
Posts: 15539

PostPosted: Sun Jan 31, 16 8:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
    

The scientific and common usage are rather different anyway, and since you raise the subject of yew trees Slim, trees are just as bad.

If you talk about conifers, there are some, like larch that are deciduous, and others that are berry bearing like yew and juniper. If you classify as hardwoods and softwoods, some deciduous trees are harder than conifers. Does make things difficult.

Slim



Joined: 05 Mar 2006
Posts: 6533
Location: New England (In the US of A)
PostPosted: Sun Jan 31, 16 12:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
    

Mistress Rose wrote:
If you classify as hardwoods and softwoods, some deciduous trees are harder than conifers.


I would say that most are

The "berry" bearing trees are still just bearing naked seeds with modified cone scale however.

These exceptions to the rules are the reason I find plant biology/evolution interesting. For most things in biology we figure out the broad "ground rules" and then we try to figure out how the exceptions to the rules came about. Always interesting to me.

e.g., Monocots don't produce secondary growth - except when they sort of do (palm "trees", etc...)

Nicky cigreen



Joined: 25 Jun 2007
Posts: 9702
Location: Devon, uk
PostPosted: Wed Feb 03, 16 10:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
    

cashews? i seem to remember the 'nut' is actually the seed of a fruit and it grows on the outside

Tavascarow



Joined: 06 Aug 2006
Posts: 8407
Location: South Cornwall
PostPosted: Wed Feb 03, 16 10:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
    

Nicky Colour it green wrote:
cashews? i seem to remember the 'nut' is actually the seed of a fruit and it grows on the outside

I only discovered this recently.
The seed hangs below the fruit.
(Obviously doesn't need to pass through an animals gut to break seed dormancy).

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