Home Page
   Articles
       links
About Us    
Traders        
Recipes            
Latest Articles
Perennial Veg
Page Previous  1, 2
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Downsizer Forum Index -> Grow Your Own
Author 
 Message
Sarah D



Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 2584

PostPosted: Sun Jan 09, 05 8:22 pm    Post subject:  Reply with quote    

Sea kale is another true perennial vegetable, as is the runner bean in truth.; cardoon, tree tomatoes another couple.
Permaculture, as well as looking for perennial fruit and veg, is about planting in layers - from topfruit and nuts, underplanted by shrubs, then surface vegetables and roots on the bottom layer. Another feature is its great use of mulches, both on existing beds and to bring new ground into cultivation; then there is the zoning, which takes into account the number of times the plant has to be visited and its maintenance ie the fewer times you visit it eg an apple tree, the further from the house it is planted. For crops you would pick/harvest every day, they are planted in zone 1 which is the nearest to the house for frequent use. Forest gardening (vis. Robert A J de Hart) is another aspect worth looking into.

Treacodactyl
Downsizer Moderator


Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 25697
Location: Jumping on the bandwagon of opportunism
PostPosted: Sun Jan 09, 05 9:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

Herbs and wild plants will be some other excellent threads.

Sea Kale is a great idea, it has been on the list but forgotten a little. Bugs will be pleased. How long does it need to grow before cutting and can it be eaten unbalanced? Tree toms also tempting.

I find permaculture fascinating as it's not something I've come across until recently, but it seems to match many of my ideas. I will find out some more and I'd like to know does it also encompass animals?

Tahir, when is your permaculture ready to be published.

Sarah D



Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 2584

PostPosted: Sun Jan 09, 05 9:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

Treacodactyl wrote:


Sea Kale is a great idea, it has been on the list but forgotten a little. Bugs will be pleased. How long does it need to grow before cutting and can it be eaten unbalanced? Tree toms also tempting.

I find permaculture fascinating as it's not something I've come across until recently, but it seems to match many of my ideas. I will find out some more and I'd like to know does it also encompass animals?



Sea kale is easy to raise from seed (I've done it), but is extremely susceptible to slugs and snails (happened to mine ). Sow in March/April time in the ground, and leave there for a couple of seasons to build up strength (it is blanched for harvesting, so needs to build up its strength before the first cut), then planted into its permanent position.

What do you mean by "eaten unbalanced"?

Permaculture does/can encompass animals; again, the ones that need daily or more than daily attention going near the house (eg hens) and those which require less attention (eg sheep, cows) go out in the zones further from the house. Zones are numbered, with 1 being closest to the house. Some permaculturists classify the human as Zone Zero. The movement was started by Bill Mollison in Australia, and books written by him tend to be especially suited to their climate, etc, but there are still a lot of useful and inspiring ideas to be had from them. One of the British permaculture gurus is a man called Graham Bell; I think he is based in the Borders somewhere.

Tristan



Joined: 29 Dec 2004
Posts: 392
Location: North Gloucestershire
PostPosted: Sun Jan 09, 05 9:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

Going to try perennial broccoli this year, available in lots of places, listed as 'nine star perennial'. Has anyone who's tried this got any hints?

Tristan

Sarah D



Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 2584

PostPosted: Sun Jan 09, 05 9:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

Do you mean unblanched rather than unbalanced? If so, then the answer is no; it is forced in the winter like Whitloof chicory, and it is the blanched stems that are eaten.

I grew tree tomatoes for the first time last year - they do best under glass, but produce a very thin and straggly plant that needs good support. They are known as tamarillos as well, and are native to New Zealand I think. You can buy them over here. Mine didn't fruit in the end, and I've never tasted them, but would give them another go.

Treacodactyl
Downsizer Moderator


Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 25697
Location: Jumping on the bandwagon of opportunism
PostPosted: Sun Jan 09, 05 9:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

Yes I did mean unblanched (spell checker error I'm not very good at that).

I've seen it as Wisley but never tried it, OH is very happy to try to grow it.

I've seen fruiting tamarillos at Kew Gardens. I've also got tea but this may take a while before trying.

One comment, I have read a fair bit and seen a good bit of TV ( ) but not seen much of permaculture in name. Is this just me or is it not publicised?

Tristan



Joined: 29 Dec 2004
Posts: 392
Location: North Gloucestershire
PostPosted: Sun Jan 09, 05 9:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

Permaculture made the RHS magazine last year, also the Country Smallholder, but usually seems associated with sustainable agriculture in South Africa

Tristan

Sarah D



Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 2584

PostPosted: Sun Jan 09, 05 10:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

It's not widely known, and most who are aware of it have come to it through organic gardening, and regard it as a further step. They tend to be "green" (for want of a better expression) thinkers and doers as well, and it is definitely not mainstream, and I don't think it ever will be in this country anyway.
I would thoroughly recommend Permaculture magazine as one of the best magazines available in this country, it's wonderfu and hugely inspiring, and is fairly cheap, but by sub only I think. They probably have a website too. They do a huge catalogue of environment/permaculture books called the Earth Repair Catalogue, run by a sister organisation called Permanent publications or similar.
There are also distance learning courses in permaculture theory and design available via Australia, and courses run all over the country here if you want to take it further. I like some of the design components, such as the keyhole beds and the mulch beds, tyre ponds, mandala gardens, etc.

Treacodactyl
Downsizer Moderator


Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 25697
Location: Jumping on the bandwagon of opportunism
PostPosted: Sun Jan 09, 05 10:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

The magazine will be ordered next week. I'm also a big fan of Bob Flowerdew.

At the moment I like the idea of encouraging nature as much as possible and going further. For example, enhancing hedges to include as many wild plants as possible and maybe other things such as raspberries, hops, even beans. Encouraging the wildlife and eating some game also seems to fit it well. It's another vast subject.

Treacodactyl
Downsizer Moderator


Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 25697
Location: Jumping on the bandwagon of opportunism
PostPosted: Sun Jan 09, 05 10:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

Tristan wrote:
Permaculture made the RHS magazine last year, also the Country Smallholder, but usually seems associated with sustainable agriculture in South Africa

Tristan


I do get both of those (Country Smallholding?) but must have missed them . I'll dig them out.

Tristan



Joined: 29 Dec 2004
Posts: 392
Location: North Gloucestershire
PostPosted: Sun Jan 09, 05 10:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

Might come across the articles again myself soon, only New Year's resolution was to try to organise and index mags b4 erself throws them out !!!

cab



Joined: 01 Nov 2004
Posts: 32429

PostPosted: Sun Jan 09, 05 11:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

Treacodactyl wrote:
Herbs and wild plants will be some other excellent threads.


The line between a herb and a vegetable, like the line between wild and cultivated plants, is rather narrow.

I grow some weeds on purpose; there are a couple of sow parsley plants on our lawn that I tend to mow around so I can always have some to pick, there's a wild sorrel plant in my herb patch that I rescued from a roadside after it had been dug up last year, and there are some dandelions in the garden that I give liquid fertiliser to at least as often as I do my other vegetables!

And a lot of the herbs I grow are used as much for salad as anything else; mint and lemon balm especially, but also oregano, basil and chervil. I'm not entirely sure where the line between leaf vegetable and herb really should lie.

I rekon that the easiest way to ensure low-maintenance permanent food plants in your garden might be to nurture those edible plants that -want- to grow there. You'd really, really struggle to find an easier one than, say, ground elder.

tahir



Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 44229
Location: Essex
PostPosted: Mon Jan 10, 05 9:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote    

Treacodactyl wrote:
Tahir, when is your permaculture ready to be published.


Not me mate, no actual experience but I have spoken to a few permaculture bods, hopefully it's only a matter of time till one of them gives in

wellington womble



Joined: 08 Nov 2004
Posts: 14971
Location: East Midlands
PostPosted: Mon Jan 10, 05 10:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote    

Permaculture sounds really interesting - it's a shame there isn't more around about it. I imagine for a lot of people it's a whole system, but for people like me (who are beset with good intentions about the garden!) it sounds as though there are some very sound principles that anyone could apply - like putting crops you need to do most to closest to the house.

Sarah D



Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 2584

PostPosted: Mon Jan 10, 05 2:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote    

Like a lot of things, permaculture lends itself very well to extracting the bits you want to use or have a go at that are relevant to you and your situation, and leaving what is not so suitable without having to apply the whole system.

Post new topic   Reply to topic    Downsizer Forum Index -> Grow Your Own All times are GMT
Page Previous  1, 2
Page 2 of 2
View Latest Posts View Latest Posts

 

Archive
Powered by php-BB © 2001, 2005 php-BB Group
Style by marsjupiter.com, released under GNU (GNU/GPL) license.
Copyright 2004 marsjupiter.com